Updated: May 8
Many people struggle with how anger affects their relationships, success and self-worth. Hypnosis can help.
In this episode you will learn:
Ideas for moving through anger and other emotions skillfully.
Ways to choose your level of emotional intensity so that it fits your real life outcome.
How learning self-acceptance can help you surrender out of anger.
Hello everybody I'm Robbie Spier Miller, your host for the hypnosis show podcast. Today we are going to explore the topic of how hypnosis can help people manage anger. Many people struggle with how anger affects their relationships, success and self-worth.In this episode you will learn: Ideas for moving through anger and other emotions skillfully. Ways to choose your level of emotional intensity so that it fits your real life outcome, and how learning self-acceptance can help you surrender out of anger.
Joshua Kirnie will be joining us. He has dedicated most of his life to helping people improve their own lives. He is a veteran discharged honourably from the United States Marine Corps. He has been the owner of 3 hypnosis clinics, and is currently the director of Power and Light Hypnosis in Kansas City, Missouri. Josh is also a Master Hypnotist Society Trainer.
We're welcoming Joshua Kernie. He's a hypnotist and part of the Master Hypnotist Society, he's the director of Alternative Hypnosis in Syracuse, New York, Power and Light Hypnosis in Kansas City, and he's also the former director of North Country Hypnosis also in New York state. Welcome Josh! Start by sharing with what your personal experience has been in terms of having you know, maybe some.
Thank you for having me Robbie I'm honored. I'm glad to be 1 of your guests. Thank you.
Extreme reactions to life or or challenges with anger and how hypnosis that helped you grow through that.
So this just popped into my mind I I can't wait to share about anger and and how it it has kind of a double-edged sword. Most people would think that it's just a negative emotion but it actually is an indicator for many things that's happening in the moment with somebody when they're in front of you. And it actually should be celebrated and and for that reason only right? So before we go on I was thinking about this in the car on the way over to the office today I really want to to approach something that I hear a lot. Um the flip side coin of what I'm going to say today. The flip of the flip side of the coin right? so. In extreme or certain circumstances when it's appropriate and it's rare. You can use negative emotion to push people into a new strategy if. That's the only viable solution you can find in the moment right? and you know we're under certain time constraints sometimes so. It can be rarely used to push people to motivate them into a strategy that's new. A new behavior generally speaking. You don't want to be running away from anything and into something else because you know how that ends. But if it's necessary and somebody's in an extreme circumstance. You want to be as flexible as possible. That being said I kind of want to move that portion of everything to the side so we don't need to discuss it anymore and have people focus on something that's really important here in the fact that you don't really need anger but it is something that you've been trained to do so. The way I was taught when I first entered the industry was that anger is a preemptive strike against fear and that's why it's such a good indicator of the negative spots that people can be in in the moment. So um, as from our standpoint where we sit and we're dealing with somebody who's going through something that they want to change or they have a goal that they want to achieve. Right? They have ah a plan of where they want to be they want to get out of and a certain ah type of pain when they show us anger. It's actually a good thing because then we know what? what track we're on we we have an idea we have like a thermometer. We know what's going on in front of us. That's the way I see it. But frankly, you know living with anger is. Is really destructive as a long-term solution to anything and you know in 1996 the American Medical Association did the study on negative emotions and how they affect physical health right? And what they really were focused on was depression and guilt. But they also ran through fear and anger and. There's a whole chart now. That's available to us on how those things can affect the physical body. So it's true that it's not only harming you emotionally but anger can harm people physically as well now my personal experience with anger um is pretty vast because being in the military being in the marine corps.
Um, it was almost as if motivation came right after Irritation. So if somebody who was ah had a superior rank or standing to you showed that they were irritated with you. It would give you a sense of urgency to move forward into something so you're programmed to do that over and over and over again and when you're in a a more common Civilian life or in a life. That's. You know we're actually the things we do are very technical and fragile at some levels right? when that's just not appropriate I mean again, it's like break glass in case of emergency Stuff. So I found in myself my own life that that was too easy to access. Um, whether I was dealing with and I coached basketball for years Young men or young women or my own children or or people that were just in my charge or people that I came across just you know during the course of the day it really wasn't getting the response that that you wanted to get. You know it's almost like a quick fix that doesn't fix anything. Right? It's just a simple response that that kind of changes the temperature of the room usually for the negative right? And of course, um, you know you want to find new and flexible ways to do that. But it also is a very good indicator that somebody's scared of something that's the way I see anger.
Okay, all right? So so there's some interesting points here because one is that let's say somebody wasn't even prone anger and then they went into the military. It sounds like they trained you.
That's the way I approach anger.
Into having that response to anger and so you you have this hypnotic trance that was developed with this reinforcement over time that that it it can become a habit right? So with their intent The the intensity of whoever was giving the orders they were sparking fear in the person.
But it might not have been their own baggage that was causing the fear. It was just a behavioral thing that they were using as a technique is that accurate. Yeah.
I would agree a hundred percent yeah
And then we have the people who maybe somebody grew up in a family where there was a lot of anger or they didn't feel free to express themselves and so sometimes it can bubble over like a dam that builds and builds and builds and then it bursts open and so.
So in terms of family of origin or the way that we have dealt with emotion sometimes people might be responding that way as well and it seems normal because you some people might have had that experience as a regular part of life or a way to motivate themselves or a way to protect themselves.
Um I would agree. Um and when you talk about family of origin which is so important and in the way that things are dictated. Um I can imagine that as well in many different circumstances and people pop into my mind that I've worked with closely. Um, and and many different capacities that you can if you go back and and review it You can notice where those things were were um, prominent I Guess where those things ah made sense to other people other people in the moment or they just naturally went into that response and you can actually notice. In those moments you review you can actually change your response to what you would do now in that sense. So It's kind of cool. That's all I Have to say it's kind of Cool. So um, it is though it is. There's a lot of currency in certain areas right in certain families. There's a lot of currency in that kind of negative emotion meaning something special like this means. Extra special because I'm super p Od right? This must be super important and it just those 2 things should just never shake Hands. They should never be acquainted with each other you know.
Yeah, yeah, so you learned how to change that response for yourself. So So give some examples of where that's different for you now where maybe in the past you had this really. In Greater intense response and now you you have another choice.
So I would. So it was easier to not show it and still feel it at first. So I wouldn't outwardly get angry at people overt I wouldn't overtly get angry at people right? and it would be I would build up. But again you know. If you have the regiment that we preach if people take time for themselves and do physical activities very easy to manage emotions when you're physically every day paying attention to yourself and whatever that means I I happen to go to the gym right? So that helped but I knew consciously it wasn't appropriate in the moments that it would happen. Me personally and so it kind of went to something else and maybe I would intellectualize my way out of it at first or maybe I would just let it pass right through me after the the work really had to go in at a deeper level when I wasn't getting angry at myself right? So when I thought that maybe I let somebody down. Or um, didn't pull my weight enough so I'm very adamant of making sure that I get my role done for the most part for the most part I mean in many different areas and it could pop up at any time letting that pass through you when you're actually pointing it at yourself. I think is the evolution of letting go of anger I mean that's where you know you realize you can relax and you can plan ahead and make it a schedule to plan ahead and when you do that and you have all these different things working for what you want then the the negative emotion really it looks more and more absurd the more often it it comes around right? It looks absurd because it's not. Handling the weight of of your behavior. It's not ah finding a way to your goal the way that it used to.
So instead of it instead of thinking it's happening to you you see? Oh I have a choice here so it brings to mind. We have lots of weight loss clients who get angry at themselves for eating junk food or eating too much. For example.
Um, ah exactly how.
And they'll they'll do it and then afterwards they'll be really upset with themselves and that bad feeling will will make them want to actually do it more right? They'll say oh well I already messed up why bother and they they give up or they end up in complacency which is a form of anger itself right? there.
Um, like punishment.
Punishing themselves for that or giving up and I I that would be sort of an explicit behavior that we can notice in a lot of people but I bet you've had the experience and lots of other people about the experience of doing this in other ways.
Um, oh absolutely.
So um, what will you hit the nail right on the head you know that that's like the reward cancellation that people go through and I think is the most common thing that I see in the clinic in our clinics right now of course that changes in waves you know, kind of just meanders one way or the other. But right now you know it's something I even call out early. So they can understand what it feels like and I'll even walk them through the paces of it so they can realize it's okay to you know, go to someone's birthday party run into that aunt that was so mean to them when they were a kid and all of a sudden they they just lose their bearings for fifteen or twenty minutes and eat something that they wouldn't I mean I'm making a weird example I don't have an aunt personally that ever you know I just thought of that just came to my mind. Um, but anything in the situation especially when they're around family around people that are used to the way they were when they weren't in control of themselves or weren't goal oriented. Um the cancellation though is a real pain. that's a bear and that's I mean that's what we're we're speaking about is the the cancellation of thinking that maybe. You know I can give myself this or I can give myself this much rope and then just no matter what it is. It could be an extra glass or cup of coffee I mean there's no real rational reason. Why people do it? Um, and then all of a sudden boom they're on themselves and they're feeling bad and they make sure they let us know some people let us know as soon as they come back in the clinic right.
Was great for six days and there was 2 hours on Sunday where I was out of control like but how about all those other hours you were away from us. You seem like you're doing you hitting the nail right in the head.
Brain And what do you learn from the time you were out of control so that next time you can do it a different way is is a really important part of this as well. Yeah, because that's that we're getting people out of a.
Um, ah ah yeah.
Shame blame guilt mode and into a learning mode so that they they actually have a choice you know Josh 1 thing I've personally found I know before I discovered hypnosis and Nlp there were many things going on in my life that I did I did want to change.
Um, and I would get really angry at myself because I knew I wanted to change them and I could see what I was doing that wasn't what I wanted but I would keep doing it over and over and over and I remember writing my journal and saying I should do this and I should do that and why can't I be like this other person and it was really through these skills of.
Um, ah, um.
Was this an nlp in the experience of it that I discovered how I could actually change that because a lot of people are trying to lecture themselves out of it or think it through or you know some version of that They believe that that's what's gonna fix the.
And ah out of control or out of control the sense that they're not dictating the way their mind is going. They will go to the thing that they know the best or what they used to when they're a kid. They'll go back to the old behaviors that they were trained or hypnotized into before they realize they're being hypnotized every day before they came to see us right.
Um, yeah, and that's especially true when people are in situations that maybe they you know aren't as resourceful that day. Maybe they're exhausted. Maybe there's something emotional going on in their life. So when we're less resourceful. We're more likely to.
Go back to the old way as well. Yeah, good all right? So is there anything else but you want to share with this.
I would agree cool.
I was on a sailboat one day. What's really cool about the sailboat experience is that it's beautiful outside right. He already expects because of the weather being different than you're used to I mean you got anything you could want to keep your blood sugar up I mean plenty of water everything that you need is there. Of course there's no escape right? So you actually have what you want to change there and it's on a boat and the boat is moving through water that you can't jump into right to escape. So you have to face the problem head on so he was talking to me and he was being very candid I was on um I was on the boat with Dr Burke and um he told me about intensity and so you know I was used to getting results me personally and I know other people like this especially other men my age and this generation. That would just ramp the intensity all the way up to a hundred right away and just like push push push push push and get whatever you want and of course there's all kinds of collateral damage. Everyone right? You're exhausted right? You don't know what you've run over to get there and talking about being more delicate with our energy. And Scott McFall taught me how to be more delicate and kind of crank that dial down to about between 60 and 70 so everything isn't like you're not in a foxhole right? You're not getting shot at and that's what the intensity is like at 100 so when you just want to get something done in your focus. You can just bring that intensity down which intensity and anger are very closely related if. If you go too far one way or the other and drop it down to 60 to 70% and then and then watch as you get your goal in a reasonable amount of time while being mindful of what's happening in the other circumstances. That's one of the great things that I learned on that trip last April.
So it's not all or nothing that you can use some of the energy of it but have it just at the right spot to to get things done.
Um, on the sailboat.
And be able to adjust it even if you want to be finer with it if you want to do 62% or 71 just knowing that you can have access to that and you don't have to just full blast run over everything to get what you want be as people would say a bull in a China shop. Which is something I have resorted to in the past I don't know if you've been aware of that or not but it's okay.
Yeah, 1 thing I've found like personally if I were to talk about my own experience with anger is that sometimes things get to a point where I tend to want to smooth things over just in terms of my personality. But sometimes things get to a point where I can't anymore and it may come out as anger because lives smooth it over for so long and but there's something important in that experience that I need to pay attention to and so if I were to just get mad at myself for getting angry and ignore.
Point of it that wouldn't help right? And so 1 thing that I've learned how to do is kind of listen to myself earlier like tune in to what what I really want or be able to communicate about that better so that the dam doesn't need to build up and up and up and up and up and.
So it helps a lot to just be aware of what it is that you want to need and have those communication skills so that it doesn't become a huge problem.
So I think that's an important point and that's you know when you were comfortable with the detail you're talking about some very delicate things for some people right? and other people that might be even natural and there's all people in between but having that ability to slip into that delicate detail. And be able to make adjustments as you're as you're talking about I think is is incredibly important and I also want to make the point that it's something that's available. It's ah these skills are available to anybody that wants to explore them. I mean it's something. That's very human to be able to make these changes. It's very human to have the initial problem. And it's very human to change it and and let it morph into something else and something that you're you're actually directing. It's like a directed change also with anger remember it's in a very a very important part of the bell curve of grief I don't know how I lost that there for a second but um. So if it does serve that purpose. It's an important feeling to have because then you know you're going through the evolution the evolution of that bell curve and if you can follow it all the way through and you're not afraid to cry at the end of it which is what people are supposed to do right and you walk into acceptance then you do want that anger as a function of that that bell curve. But again you know as we've been taught. As I've been taught too. People tend to to bounce into it. Enjoy the feeling and just recycle the anger and that's no good That's no good.
Right? So you could feel it and without fixating on it or you can feel it and maybe process it through physical activity or through hypnosis skills and experiences instead of having to losh out right.
Feeling or doesn't mean necessarily that you have to express it at the person or the situation or that it has to build and build and build. It's being able to interact with it in a useful way.
Yeah, and so ah, thank you.
Um, good stuff. You're very easy to talk to I don't know if you're gonna erase this but your voice is incredible. It's I mean for real.
One of the books that's part of our curriculum in Master Hypnotist Society is by Dr Edgar Barnett who happens to be from Kingston, Ontario, Canada - 1 of the rare Canadians.
And he talks about crime of anger which happens when if as a child it wasn't okay to get angry and then you get angry. You feel like it's a crime and so that's when people tend to bottle it up and and what is much healthier is to be able to move through it and and to let it flow. And I think that that's an important way to look at it I I found that very helpful.
That's a great way. Yeah, um, so you know I just decided this thought I don't know if this fits in or not but I mean so I'm just thinking that like what's also very helpful is surrounding yourself with likeminded people to what I mean your common goals are. And what you your expectations are and having people comfortable with being able to go through the things they need to go through that sounded cryptic. So try that again. So if you surround yourself with people that are all the common mind a common goal or a relatively common goal so you can have. Can go through these things and you can go through this emotional distress and walk through it and but let it pass through you in their midst and there won't be any expected recourse I don't know why that popped into my mind but it just did so I'm thinking also now I'm I'm placing it in different things you can look at the families right? and families are always a little bit crazy and that's not a big deal right. And can also look like when we work in small and larger groups together in the mhs. You know we've had different crowds many times right? and I remember that when I I think when I first worked with you. The first time I met you was in 2015 and cape coral. We had a big group of ps when I met Dan the first time too. Dr Burow um
And then in 2017 we were in at at Disney Hotel and we had both trainers master trainers we had and then we had brand new students all in the same Scott had them all in the same room and those are the situations that I'm thinking of and how we could even accept people going through those things. And even assist right in any way that we can and then how comfortable it can be to go through the anger go through the grief or go through the sadness and we've both I'm sure we've both seen people go through sadness and seminars before especially you I mean you have these big seminars like every month you know what? I mean I'm sure you have to go through this all the time. So.
And when they're they're comfortable doing that how much faster and how much um, more powerful. Let's say the learning experience is when those those things are on the table. Those things are acceptable. It's acceptable to go through the things you need to go through and that just came into my mind I don't know if you want that or not think.
Right? Well I think that's a great point because it's this culture of acceptance that you can you can have that happen right? You might act out or go through different emotions or do something that maybe isn't the the most desirable thing to do and. In general people have experiences with that are either embarrassing or they get abandoned by people or shunned or that would be a typical experience whether it's in the family or in society in general or the workplace or with friends.
And and one of the wonderful and beautiful things about but what we do is we create a culture that allows people to move through that so they can get to another place because the the reaction of the people around. You can have an impact on you staying stuck if you. Agree with that or you take it in and so so that this this value of loving people and then helping them change. Their behavior is a really healing thing about what we do.
It makes for a fantastic culture too. As you said yeah, a culture of acceptance is pretty neat I'm gonna write that down.
Josh, share with people how they can reach you if they would like help or more information about what you do.
Oh my God thank you I appreciate it.
Oh excellent. So you can find us at Destiny Hypnosis destiny hypnosis dot com um Destiny Hypnosis on Instagram we have two Twitter handles Destiny Hypnosis and New York Hypnosis and of course on Facebook. Can find us on Facebook at Alternative Hypnosis and Power and Light Hypnosis. Um, so yeah and I'll read when people reach out, they reach out by email they call. They also direct message us and I get right back to them so I've had lots of cool conversations with people that I never would have met if it wasn't for our group. The MHS the Master Hypnotist Society and our presence on on the internet, all of our presences is on the internet. It’s starting to grow every day.